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Post by taylor on Apr 9, 2010 22:46:34 GMT -5
it's #9 with a +173 bullet right now so it's not over
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Post by Zack on Apr 9, 2010 22:53:47 GMT -5
oh okay. good. this deserves to go #1.
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Post by WILL™ on Apr 11, 2010 4:58:18 GMT -5
really? Why is a #9 peak bad exactly? I'm really struggling to understand that mentality. The last time I checked, a top 10 on any format is good. Taylor doesn't have the pull on country radio that Carrie does; not all of her singles are guaranteed to go to the top 2 at the very least. Sure, a #9 peak would be a bit lower than her average single, but still certainly nothing embarrassing or troubling. I don't think country radio should ever be used to gauge the size of a country artist's fanbase. Country radio is easily manipulated and controlled by labels, not fans. When her album and single sales dissipate we can start to worry about a dwindling fanbase.
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Post by DJ 7.0 on Apr 11, 2010 10:16:24 GMT -5
She had four songs in a row that hit either 1 or 2 out of 10 songs (and one isn't even over yet) so I would say Taylor is expected to hit the top 2 each time. She has had 6 out of 10 songs hit the top 2...
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Post by Zack on Apr 11, 2010 21:37:09 GMT -5
Will, top 10 is indeed a great accomplishment, but for Taylor's standards it is a bit disappointing if that is all she achieves. Taylor had consecutive top 5 hits with all of her singles from her first album and the first 3 off of "Fearless" including 5 of those hitting #1 on BB or MB. With "Fifteen" missing the top 5 on Country, that is a bit of a disappointment. It was still a hit but not to the degree of her previous singles. And if "Fearless" had peaked at #9, that would have been 2 under-performing singles for her status. She was the Entertainer of the Year for Country music for goodness sakes, she should have all her singles hitting the top 3.
Her album sales are so big because of her crossover success mainly, not just her country fanbase. So if she stopped releasing songs to country and only catered to Pop radio, I'm sure her album sales would not suffer in the least. So my stating of her COUNTRY fanbase has disappeared was a mere exaggeration, but also directed to her status on Country radio only, not radio altogether.
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Post by WILL™ on Apr 11, 2010 22:17:22 GMT -5
Will, top 10 is indeed a great accomplishment, but for Taylor's standards it is a bit disappointing if that is all she achieves. Taylor had consecutive top 5 hits with all of her singles from her first album and the first 3 off of "Fearless" including 5 of those hitting #1 on BB or MB. With "Fifteen" missing the top 5 on Country, that is a bit of a disappointment. It was still a hit but not to the degree of her previous singles. And if "Fearless" had peaked at #9, that would have been 2 under-performing singles for her status. I remember saying something similar to what I'm about to say about Carrie here last year. The bar is set so high that even singles that perform decently but just miss out on what most deem to be "typical" will seem like an under-performance to some, which is absolutely absurd. To me, a top 10 is a top 10. Success all-around. I'd say the same for any pop artist (even GaGa). Is it as big as her previous releases? No. Is it a flop or a cause for immediate concern? No. People are acting as if the country side of her career is over, because a single peaked at #10! Do most even realize just how ridiculous that is? I imagine I'll be having this same discussion when Carrie peaks at like #4 or #5 with a single (which, again, I am sure melodramatic people will be flipping out over). I'd say the "Entertainer of the Year" isn't solely (or even substantially) based on country radio performance. It's based on a number of things. How does anyone know this? There is no way of knowing this for certain. People are just speculating at this point. Don't get me wrong, I am sure pop audiences padded her figure substantially (obviously) but I'd still argue the album would have been a huge success without the crossover hits (3 million). Hell, her first album sold nearly five million copies with only one moderately successful crossover hit. I disagree. No way do I believe Fearless could have sold 6 million copies without the support of country audiences. Her sales would absolutely suffer (to some extent) without either of her core audiences. Without the support of country audiences, her next album would still perform well, but still fall far below what it could have potentially sold. Yeah, but I still think country radio is a horrible way to gauge how big an artist's fanbase is. The format is so easily manipulated. Hell, it's basically controlled by labels. It has very little to do with fans in my opinion. The fact that labels are able to "slow down" songs or "speed up" songs should give one a good idea of what kind of a grip they have on country radio programmers.
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Post by Billy Uranus on Apr 11, 2010 22:26:42 GMT -5
She sells as many albums from MTV/Youtube to teen girls as she does radio. Because seriously, what teenage girl (other than my future wife) listens to the radio?
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Post by WILL™ on Apr 11, 2010 22:34:20 GMT -5
I am sure a large portion of her sales do come from teenage girls but it still doesn't settle the country/pop fanbase debate. I mean, there is no way to determine how many of those teenagers are country music fans as opposed to pop fans (or even a mix between the two). It's all just up for speculation. I still say a her fanbase is more evenly distributed between the two formats than some would believe. I'm sure a hell of a lot of young "country" girls love her. I know all of my nieces do. I know quite a few people who try and attribute her success solely to pop audiences, but I'd argue she has a pretty strong country following.
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Post by Late Winter on Apr 11, 2010 23:07:45 GMT -5
I think I see where you guys are both coming from, but I guess it is a little surprising to see Fearless peak relatively low as Taylor is at the peak of her career now. And with the way country radio can possibly be influenced, why not try to manipulate another #1 for the genre's biggest star right now? But that said, assuming the songs themselves actually played some sort of role in their chart fates, I don't know why they picked Fearless and Fifteen to be singles Maybe Taylor was feeling really confident thinking that she was big enough to have enough leverage to release whatever she wanted, even if the songs wasn't necessarily the most radio friendly choices. Or maybe they really felt these were the best single choices. But at least they weren't the best choices to me.
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Post by WILL™ on Apr 12, 2010 14:00:30 GMT -5
Does this have a new peak of #8 on Mediabase? I think it does!
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Post by Just No on Apr 12, 2010 16:39:33 GMT -5
Her album sales are so big because of her crossover success mainly, not just her country fanbase. . To me you can only milk a country fanbase to like 2 million at tops nowadays. Everything else can be contributed to crossover success.
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Post by WILL™ on Apr 12, 2010 17:12:27 GMT -5
Her album sales are so big because of her crossover success mainly, not just her country fanbase. . To me you can only milk a country fanbase to like 2 million at tops nowadays. Everything else can be contributed to crossover success. I disagree. Carnival Ride sold three million copies without even one crossover hit (and it was released only one year earlier than Fearless - potential didn't dwindle that much in the span of a year).
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Post by Just No on Apr 12, 2010 17:31:23 GMT -5
To me you can only milk a country fanbase to like 2 million at tops nowadays. Everything else can be contributed to crossover success. I disagree. Carnival Ride sold three million copies without even one crossover hit (and it was released only one year earlier than Fearless - potential didn't dwindle that much in the span of a year). Carnival Ride got to 3 mil off the strength of Some Hearts and from the fact she has fans from AI. No other country artist other than Taylor Swift could do that. Sugarland(biggest duo of the past few years)-couldn't sell more than the low 2 mils Rascal Flats haventold over 3 mil since their last country crossover success. So yeah 2 mil is about tops for country artists these days.
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Post by WILL™ on Apr 12, 2010 17:40:50 GMT -5
Yeah, but none of the artists you listed (Carrie/Sugarland/Rascal Flatts) particularly appeal to younger country audiences as strongly as Taylor does. That buyer demographic is what moves more units than any other these days. Taylor is really the first artist to tap into that in the world of country (I remember reading articles that stated the same), so it's not surprising her numbers could potentially be a bit higher than what is typical.
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Post by Just No on Apr 12, 2010 17:52:24 GMT -5
Taylor Swift was starting to slow down prior to TOMG being released to pop. She had already sold nearly 1.4 mil. Not until her rerelease and pop airply did taylor soar. Same for Carrie with Some hearts. She did well coming from AI but she wouldve stalled around 4 mil if not for BHC massive success.
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Post by WILL™ on Apr 12, 2010 20:20:27 GMT -5
Not until her rerelease and pop airply did taylor soar. Which also coincidentally happened as Our Song became a huge success (arguably her first song that really connected with younger country audiences).
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Post by Just No on Apr 12, 2010 20:35:19 GMT -5
Not until her rerelease and pop airply did taylor soar. Which also coincidentally happened as Our Song became a huge success (arguably her first song that really connected with younger country audiences). Young country audiences ate up teardrops and tim mcgraw so I don't get the Our Song being any of a greater impact than her previous hits in regards to young country audiences?
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Post by WILL™ on Apr 12, 2010 20:46:47 GMT -5
^ Really? Our Song was a huge digital success (selling over two million copies) without being released to pop (crossing over). I don't recall Tim McGraw selling anywhere near that amount and Teardrops On My Guitar sold so much by crossing over. It was obvious that Our Song (by its success and theme) became her first big hit with younger audiences. How many country songs have sold so much despite not being released or becoming successful on formats outside of country?
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Post by Just No on Apr 12, 2010 20:49:26 GMT -5
Our Song did cross over, don't you remember? It wasnt as successful as TOMG but it did well for a country song.
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Post by WILL™ on Apr 12, 2010 20:53:11 GMT -5
Our Song did cross over, don't you remember? It wasnt as successful as TOMG but it did well for a country song. I think we're really stretching at this point. #19 is hardly anything to write home about, yes even for a country song (and it certainly wouldn't warrant the huge digital sales).
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Post by Just No on Apr 12, 2010 21:02:27 GMT -5
Our Song did cross over, don't you remember? It wasnt as successful as TOMG but it did well for a country song. I think we're really stretching at this point. #19 is hardly anything to write home about, yes even for a country song (and it certainly wouldn't warrant the huge digital sales). No stretch at all. It was only a little over 500k after it had finished its run on country in January 08. It didnt sell well until it hit Pop radio and Im sorry rank 19 or whatev is great for a country artist on pop. Maybe not a huge hit but at least moderate.
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Post by WILL™ on Apr 12, 2010 21:07:12 GMT -5
No stretch at all. It was only a little over 500k after it had finished its run on country in January 08. It didnt sell well until it hit Pop radio I'm having a hard time believing the song sold two million copies from pop radio alone after peaking at #19. Hell, at that rate, the song could have sold three million more if it would have hit top 10 and would have went on to become the best-selling digital single of all time. lol Yeah, Our Song had only just entered pop radio's top 50 (@ #47) the week of March 2nd and had already sold 1.13 million copies (@ 30,000 copies a week). 25 32 SWIFT*TAYLOR OUR SONG 30441 -16 36169 1138284
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Post by Just No on Apr 12, 2010 21:19:34 GMT -5
No stretch at all. It was only a little over 500k after it had finished its run on country in January 08. It didnt sell well until it hit Pop radio I'm having a hard time believing the song sold two million copies from pop radio alone after peaking at #19. Hell, at that rate, the song could have sold three million more if it would have hit top 10 and would have went on to become the best-selling digital single of all time. lol Be-Weave it. This is post xmas week. Single Sales for the week ending 12/30/07 23 15 SWIFT*TAYLOR OUR SONG 133,506 248 38,371 708,468 And this is after its run on pop in June 08 SWIFT*TAYLOR OUR SONG 23,295 -5 24,627 1,618,451
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Post by Billy Uranus on Apr 12, 2010 21:20:08 GMT -5
Let's not forget that Taylor Swift is on the cover of almost every magazine targeted towards teen and pre-teen girls. And of course, kids now are influenced more by the music videos they see on MTV2, Vh1 and youtube than they are the radio.
3 Doors Down had a top 10 CHR hit in 2008, but I didn't see young kids running to their computers to download that.
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Post by Just No on Apr 12, 2010 21:20:38 GMT -5
lol I had to go to lelia's thread too.
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